Is this pivotless dsign the same as Cannondale are using on the Scalpels - except that Cannondale are using carbon fibre, not aluminium?

dont mean 2 flame, but this bikes been available 4 ages!! check cambriabike.com, its even on sale! no the design isnt like the c'dales (original fsr copy) its more like a moots. u can still get ibis via ebay.co in US..
l8tz

Scant, the news is that he's been granted a patent. And the only bit of a Scalpel that's like the original FSR is the shock linkage.

Si, the Cannondale design is intended to only flex in one point, while Castellano's patent covers flat plate chainstays flexing along their whole length.

so why did u write "2 launch a new brand" ??!!
yeh so fsr aint da same,(just similiar link) an i never said it was, just a c'dale rip off (much like action-tecs headshock)

It's a bit sad, what's considered patentable in the states.

I still can't believe that no-one has told specialized to go take a running jump with there four-bar linkage patent. It's a mechanism that has existed since the dawn of engineering, so it's hardly new and innovative.
I guess the bottom line is that specialized have a bigger law firm than the competition.

Scant, you described the Scalpel as an "orginal fsr copy". That sounds like saying it's the same to me... And you may already be familiar with the Castellano Fango but I'd wager most people aren't, therefore it's news.

gees man, i ment da linkage, obs entire c'dale aint da same!!!
ok, how about merlin are only producing 1 ti hardtail for 2003! XLM, no more mtn, newsboy etc?? thats news. or that the FOX AVA shock can simply replace a float one.
l8tz, time 2 ride now..

Nothing you say is 'obs'.

I bet Merlin make more than one bike in 2003. I've heard of low production numbers, but one is just silly.

Your insight into the Fox shock is not news, it's what we call 'stating the obvious' and what you would doubtless call 'statin da obs'.

:-)

Ho Hum.

Why is it that sometimes people who are apparently knowledgeable have the patience and attention to detail of a 10 year old.

Shame really.


My 3 ha'porth is that WHATEVER the man says, there's no way I'd spend a grand on a frame design where ali stays were designed to flex. This really doesn't look clever.

Cheers for clearing that one up for me Mike.

Thought they sounded rather similar.

If you go look at the patent you'll see that the patent is for a totally pivotless suspension system, with a traditional rear triangle shape, with a shock allowing angular movement, and using planar chain stays. So Craconfale's scalpel design isn't included in that because it doesn't have planar chainstays (although one part is flattened) it has pivots, and the shock doesn't allow angular movements.

Specialized's patent isn't actually on using a 4-bar linkage for suspension - VPP, ETS-X, Cannondale Fulcrum etc are not covered. In fact it doesn't necessarily have to be a 4-bar linkage. Both a bike that has 3 pivots, one near and higher than the BB, one in front of and and BELOW the dropout, and one above the shock, with the shock mounted rigidly to the seatstay needs a licence from Spesh. The 4-bar linkage arrangement in FSRs is also mentioned.

It's a patent on a specific suspension configuration not on 4-bar linkages per se.

mike
u're wrong, get yer facts straight! merlin r only producin 1 ti mtb, the XLM. maybe u could do like i did an contact merlin rather than guess!
ancient mariner, get wif da times. less characters 2 type, therefore quicker. yer pointless flame type comments r childish.
this all started when i pointed out that bikemagic made a big thing outta showin castellos new soft tail, when in reality it aint new, wow a patent. like thats news!
i didnt start this as a rant, yet it turned in2 1, due to , "ah no, some 1 knows summit i dont". i aint sayin i know it all. never did!
chill out all
l8ta

The patent is an interesting read, esp the bit in the claim section -

8. The bicycle frame of claim 7, wherein said lever comprises an A-arm.

9. The bicycle frame of claim 7, wherein said shock absorber comprises a spring.

10. The bicycle frame of claim 7, wherein said shock absorber comprises an elastomer.

11. The bicycle frame of claim 7, wherein said shock absorber comprises a spring and elastomer in combination.

12. The bicycle frame of claim 7, wherein said shock absorber comprises a hydraulic shock absorber.

13. The bicycle frame of claim 7, wherein said shock absorber comprises a spring and hydraulic shock absorber in combination.

Dosen't seem to mention anything about air-shocks. So if you had an air-spring, would their patent cover it?

ian, get a patent in their quick! then sell it back 2 em for loadsa £££ !!!! ahhaahahaha

i think that would be covered by point 12 and/or 13, unless it's an air/air shock. But then Spesh only charge $1 per frame licence which is hardly extortionate! It's more just about advertising as they get their stickers stuckon other people's frames.

For 2003 the XLM is the only mountain bike. It is possible to have canti bosses welded on while the frames are still here. There is a small upcharge to do this.

Steve Dunn
Merlin East Coast & International Sales
423.238.4923 ext 228
steved@merlinbike.com
www.merlinbike.com
wasnt sure if i'd deleted it. guttin news tho, no more newsboys! and yeh the new XLMs r disc only, as mentioned above.
peace
l8tz

I doubt it's of interest to anybody, but I almost bought one of these earlier in the year in a fetching shade of lilac. But it was sold before I could make my mind up :-(

And, as it turns out, it would have matched the wallpaper in my girlfriends bedrooom.

Scant,

If you re-read Mike's post I think you'll find he said it rather tongue in cheek.

Thanks Adam. I didn't expect him to get it.

Scant, IT WAS A JOKE. You said "make one bike" (or mk 1 bik or something) rather than "have one model in the range". See? It's your wonderful economy of communication that does it.

Ian, I suspect the definition of 'spring' probably covers air shocks - it doesn't say coil spring specifically. Although it does say elastomer specifically, doesn't it?

Dave: "It's a patent on a specific suspension configuration not on 4-bar linkages per se."

Although they've got a patent on the thing that makes it possible to modify the axle path rather than just driving the shock with a linkage. So effectively the patent controls use of the whole design.