So it's really that good then? What size rear tyre did it have, and how big a tyre could you fit without it grinding to a halt in the mud?

Now, where's my wallet...

No mud clearance = pants in UK

The rear Nanoraptor is 45mm wide overall. There's a shaped bit on the inside of each seatstay for extra clearance, the available width is 63mm. So not great, but no worse than an SL. By way of comparison, a Mount Vision has 75mm between the stays and an Inbred just over 80.

Have I read this right?. Is a certain amount of effort of every pedal stroke spent lifting the bike slightly?. Perhaps a lot of suspension bikes do this to some extent. It is hard to check on my Marin Wolfridge as the act of leaning over to see affects the suspension. Would it move if I could see it?. Can I get my mate to sneak up and check while I am riding ?. Are these effects too small for most riders to notice when riding on the rough ?.

Jeff, You've not considered sag.

You sit on the bike, the suspension sags by about 25 - 30% of it's travel.
This appears to be the point that chain tension encourages the suspension to rest at.

Riding through the mud bath from hellyesterday, with the Nanoraptors on, I had no problems, with mud clearance. (Staying on the bike was more of an issue, as the tyres barged there way through the muck like a supertanker).
Besides, when it gets muddy, I take that as a hint that its time to put on my skinny mud tyres....

Jeff, your pedalling your Marin lifts the bike. The thinking behind the Blur is that in a lot of circumstances single pivot bikes do it too much while four-bar linkage bikes don't do it enough.

You can see what the suspension's doing by looking at the shock. Make sure there's nothing in the way while you're not looking where you'e going ;-)

why are you lot such a bunch of speccy bike whingers? My appolo I bought from Halfords for #120.00 could give your full sussies a run for their money in any conditions. Set the race up and let's 'av it!

Nice try, Sam, but I don't think anyone's biting ;-)

surely if you have over three grand to spend on a bike, you have a few bob spare to put away for a ss for churning through the local woods in the boggy seasons on - just think of all that chainset wear that will be saved :-)

Mike,
read with interest your thoughts on the finish. Saw one in the flesh up at LL Daventry, and it was a bit dodgy to say the least. The paint seemed really thin especially so over the welds, and most dissapointing was the lack of paint around the pivot points, where bare metal could be seen. Jon, At LL had said that they'd even contacted the importer about it, and the response had been that SC were concerned not to have overspray on the bearings.

I know that one shouldn't judge on looks alone, but it makes me wonder about the quality of the rest of the bike. I know that i'd be dissapointed to shell out the thick end of £1400 on a frame to find inattention to detail like that. I hope that SC aren't rushing production in order to have bikes in stores before Xmas.

Any thoughts?

Poor finish,lack of mud clearance,this bike is dead in the water.
If your a single pivit fan buy Superlight or Marin if not specalised.

Just returned from British Columbia Canada. No snow at the moment, but was chatting to a guy who owns a shop in Rossland called 'The Sacred Ride'.
He stocks Santa Cruz bikes and can get a frame and forks for $2000 canadian dollars, or a built bike with a mix of xt, sids and hayes discs for $3100 inc tax (approx $3500). This works out at £1400 approx ($2.5 cad to pound) which would be way less than here.
Why so expensive here? All that talk about development money etc is fine, but surely there should be some equality between uk and us and canada etc?

either way my next trip is booked and as im taking my bike out its highly likely it wont be returning with me, maybe have a Blur on board instead!

Oh btw, how does the new whyte compare with the blur? or do i buy a scalpel?

Thanks for the replies earlier guys but my original mail was a bit tongue in cheek. Every type of suspension has its drawbacks at certain times in spite of all the manufacturers' claims.Do you not feel that if one particular system was so much more efficiant than the others most would change to it. The reason why I plumped for the Marin Tara sysem Wolfridge was that at least it gave some options for more adjustment on the day but with the reliabilty of a single pivot.

Finish: I've not seen a painted one. I don't believe that they've rushed them for Christmas.

Costs: There's an extra importer in the chain when you buy here, plus the shipping costs for containerloads of bikes, plus import duty, plus VAT. And the relative weakness of the Canadian $ helps too.

New Whyte: We have a Quad bike here, not enough miles on it yet to draw conclusions. They're not dissimilar but there are important differences. The Scalpel is a very different bike.

Jeff: It's not quite as simple as that. Not every system is available to every manufacturer. Or rather, many of them are but you have to pay. Most companies would rather tout their own than admit that someone else's was better. So far the VPP has the fewest drawbacks. A single pivot is always going to have an edge in reliability.

Seif, the price difference is down to several factors. The pound is very strong at the moment (though if the importers pay for the frames in dollars this should work both ways), there is no import duty between the US and Canada but it's something like 20% to here, the UK importers will have to take a cut and (I think) retail markups are a bit more in the UK because costs are higher for shops.

Besides, you will have to pay VAT if you bring a Blur back unless you get away with smuggling it.

Mike, Are you getting an ETS to test?

I'm just interested in how you compare them.

Odd that the Americans are paying about the same price for a Sub 5 frame as we are.... where are their import duties/importers fees/dealer mark-up's etc? I know the US have fairly stringent import duties.

Our vat might be 17.5%, but most American states have 'sales tax', which varies, but is c.8% on average.

A strong home currency should make things cheaper for us... it's only a short while ago you only got $1.40 for your pound, it's c.$1.60 now. That's a 14% exchange rate swing.... see any prices of US products dropping? No, I thought not. Why? Because the importers just take the extra profit. If it's the other way round though they are the first to put up prices due to 'adverse exchane rates' etc.

Personally, I don't object to paying good money for a good product, but companies just take the piss sometimes.

Nice bike though :-)